Reference:5517 - Revision history

Klaudiusz: Deep correctness and anti-slop audit: narrow 5517 production and batch claims, remove market language, fix hero metadata and image layout

2026-09-29T02:50:02Z

Deep correctness and anti-slop audit: narrow 5517 production and batch claims, remove market language, fix hero metadata and image layout

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:50, 29 September 2026
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	{{#seo:		{{#seo:
	\|title=Rolex Submariner 5517 'MilSub' — Military Issue, 1971–1974 \| Rolexopedia		\|title=Rolex Submariner 5517 'MilSub' — Military Issue, 1971–1974 \| Rolexopedia
	\|description=The 5517 is ~~the~~ British military ~~Submariner~~. ~~Three batches across roughly 1972-1979,~~ fixed bars, full 60-minute ~~bezel~~, sword ~~hands~~, T SWISS T tritium ~~dial. Phillips Geneva XIV 2021 CHF 504,000 result is the public auction record~~.		\|description=The 5517 is a Submariner reference associated with British military procurement. Surviving records show fixed bars, full-minute bezels, sword-hand examples, and T SWISS T tritium dials across several case-marking groups.
	\|keywords=Rolex, 5517, MilSub, Royal Navy, military Submariner, broadsword hands, T SWISS T		\|keywords=Rolex, 5517, MilSub, Royal Navy, military Submariner, broadsword hands, T SWISS T
	\|image=Ref 5517 hero.webp		\|image=Ref 5517 hero 3.webp
	\|image_alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517		\|image_alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517
	\|type=Article		\|type=Article
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	== Where it sits in the line ==		== Where it sits in the line ==

	The 5517 sits outside the ordinary retail no-date Submariner line in the cited records. ~~Military~~ examples ~~are distinguished by~~ fixed bars, full-minute bezels, luminous-dial markings, sword hands on many examples, and military caseback engravings. These features are associated with Ministry of Defence specifications; the surviving records do not document the requirement for every individual part.		The 5517 sits outside the ordinary retail no-date Submariner line in the cited records. The surviving military examples show fixed bars, full-minute bezels, luminous-dial markings, sword hands on many examples, and military caseback engravings. These features are associated with Ministry of Defence specifications; the surviving records do not document the requirement for every individual part.

	The 5514 COMEX and 5517 are separate non-standard branches of the 5513-era Submariner. The 5514 is associated with COMEX; 5517 records include British military issue. Earlier military Submariner references, including A/6538 examples, predate the 5517.		The 5514 COMEX and 5517 are separate non-standard branches of the 5513-era Submariner. The 5514 is associated with COMEX; 5517 records include British military issue. Earlier military Submariner references, including A/6538 examples, predate the 5517.
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	== Bracelets, end links, clasps, and packaging notes ==		== Bracelets, end links, clasps, and packaging notes ==

	~~[[File:Ref 5517 hero 2~~.~~webp\|thumb\|right\|250px\|alt=Rolex Submariner Ref~~. ~~5517\|Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517]]~~		The cited military examples are shown on fabric straps, and the fixed bars constrain bracelet fit. Packaging and original delivery accessories are less consistently documented than the watches themselves; do not infer a complete packaging standard from one lot.

	~~The cited~~ military ~~examples are shown~~ on fabric straps, and the fixed bars constrain bracelet fit. Packaging and original delivery accessories are less consistently documented than the watches themselves; do not infer a complete packaging standard from one lot.		[[File:Ref 5517 hero 2.webp\|thumb\|right\|250px\|alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517 on military strap\|Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517 on military strap]]

	<span id="authentication-warning"></span>		<span id="authentication-warning"></span>
	== Authentication ==		== Authentication ==

	The 5517’s military parts and provenance make authentication difficult~~, and genuine examples have sold for high prices in the cited auctions~~. A standard 5513 can be altered with replacement parts, so case, bezel, dial, hands, engravings, movement, and provenance must be checked together.		The 5517’s military parts and provenance make authentication difficult. A standard 5513 can be altered with replacement parts, so case, bezel, dial, hands, engravings, movement, and provenance must be checked together.

	Phillips documents examples with caseback and movement or case-number histories that require explanation. A non-matching number requires documented service or issue history. A matching set still needs the same provenance and physical checks.		Phillips documents examples with caseback and movement or case-number histories that require explanation. A non-matching number requires documented service or issue history. A matching set still needs the same provenance and physical checks.
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	The 5517 is the dedicated Submariner of the [[Reference:milsub\|MilSub]] program, used in the third Royal Navy batch after the first two ran on 5513 cases. It sits inside the [[Reference:submariner-5xxx-family\|5xxx Submariner family]] with the chronometer 5512, the long-run civilian 5513, and the COMEX 5514.		The 5517 is the dedicated Submariner of the [[Reference:milsub\|MilSub]] program, used in the third Royal Navy batch after the first two ran on 5513 cases. It sits inside the [[Reference:submariner-5xxx-family\|5xxx Submariner family]] with the chronometer 5512, the long-run civilian 5513, and the COMEX 5514.

			<gallery mode="packed" heights="180">
			File:Ref 5517 hero 3.webp\|Rolex Submariner 5517 military-issue case and dial
			File:Ref 5517 hero 2.webp\|5517 on a military fabric strap with fixed bars
			File:Ref 5517 hero.webp\|5517 reference example
			</gallery>

	== Sources ==		== Sources ==

Klaudiusz: Align 5517 core movement fact with evidence-qualified audit

2026-09-28T04:48:24Z

Align 5517 core movement fact with evidence-qualified audit

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:48, 28 September 2026
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	\|-		\|-
	\| movement		\| movement
	\| caliber 1520, 26 jewels ~~(Major~~-house lots ~~universal: Phillips, Sotheby's, Antiquorum, Bonhams, Horobox all read 1520~~; the ~~1570 forum claim looks like contamination from standard 5512 / 5513 cases that can house either)~~		\| caliber 1520, 26 jewels in the major-house lots cited here; inspect the individual movement
	\|-		\|-
	\| case		\| case

Klaudiusz: Clean negation and table punctuation after 5517 audit

2026-09-28T04:47:58Z

Clean negation and table punctuation after 5517 audit

Klaudiusz: Deep audit: qualify 5517 military, production, movement, provenance and market claims

2026-09-28T04:47:41Z

Deep audit: qualify 5517 military, production, movement, provenance and market claims

Show changes

Admin: Layout: remove duplicate hero-style image floating above Core facts (kept in lead only)

2026-09-07T01:49:35Z

Layout: remove duplicate hero-style image floating above Core facts (kept in lead only)

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:49, 7 September 2026
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	<span id="core-facts"></span>		<span id="core-facts"></span>

	~~[[File:Ref 5517 hero.webp\|thumb\|right\|250px\|alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517\|Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517]]~~

	== Core facts ==		== Core facts ==

Admin: Layout: restore the original lead caption

2026-09-06T23:00:26Z

Layout: restore the original lead caption

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:00, 6 September 2026
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	<div class="rp-lead">		<div class="rp-lead">
	[[File:Ref 5517 hero 3.webp\|thumb\|center\|640px\|alt=Rolex 5517 ~~Submariner~~\|Rolex 5517 ~~Submariner~~]]		[[File:Ref 5517 hero 3.webp\|thumb\|center\|640px\|alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517\|Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517]]
	</div>		</div>

Admin: Layout: hero refreshed

2026-09-06T22:55:11Z

Layout: hero refreshed

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:55, 6 September 2026
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	<div class="rp-lead">		<div class="rp-lead">
	[[File:Ref 5517 hero 3.webp\|thumb\|center\|640px\|alt=Rolex Submariner ~~Ref. 5517~~\|Rolex Submariner ~~Ref. 5517~~]]		[[File:Ref 5517 hero 3.webp\|thumb\|center\|640px\|alt=Rolex 5517 Submariner\|Rolex 5517 Submariner]]
	</div>		</div>

Admin: Layout: hero promoted to lead

2026-09-06T22:30:28Z

Layout: hero promoted to lead

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:30, 6 September 2026
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	<small>[[Reference:submariner\|Submariner]] › '''5517'''</small>		<small>[[Reference:submariner\|Submariner]] › '''5517'''</small>

			<div class="rp-lead">
			[[File:Ref 5517 hero 3.webp\|thumb\|center\|640px\|alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517\|Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517]]
			</div>

	The 5517 is the MilSub: the British military Submariner, purpose-built for the Ministry of Defence and never sold through any retail channel. Production ran across three batches roughly 1972 to 1979 in two distinct serial bands — the 3.9M cluster for the early 5513 and 5513/5517 double-reference watches, the 5.3M cluster for the dedicated 5517 batch.		The 5517 is the MilSub: the British military Submariner, purpose-built for the Ministry of Defence and never sold through any retail channel. Production ran across three batches roughly 1972 to 1979 in two distinct serial bands — the 3.9M cluster for the early 5513 and 5513/5517 double-reference watches, the 5.3M cluster for the dedicated 5517 batch.
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	[[File:Ref 5517 hero 2.webp\|thumb\|right\|250px\|alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517\|Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517]]		[[File:Ref 5517 hero 2.webp\|thumb\|right\|250px\|alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517\|Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517]]
	~~[[File:Ref 5517 hero 3.webp\|thumb\|right\|250px\|alt=Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517\|Rolex Submariner Ref. 5517]]~~

	Military-issue watches were delivered on NATO-style fabric straps rather than metal bracelets, in keeping with the fixed-bar design. The bars do not take a standard Oyster bracelet, and the NATO pass-through is deliberate — the strap continues beneath the watch even if one bar fails, so the watch stays on the wrist. Packaging followed procurement logistics: watches arrived in military stores packaging, not standard Rolex retail boxes.		Military-issue watches were delivered on NATO-style fabric straps rather than metal bracelets, in keeping with the fixed-bar design. The bars do not take a standard Oyster bracelet, and the NATO pass-through is deliberate — the strap continues beneath the watch even if one bar fails, so the watch stays on the wrist. Packaging followed procurement logistics: watches arrived in military stores packaging, not standard Rolex retail boxes.

Admin: site-wide: layout classes (core-facts card, breadcrumb, entry-point cards)

2026-09-05T01:21:47Z

site-wide: layout classes (core-facts card, breadcrumb, entry-point cards)

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:21, 5 September 2026
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	}}		}}

	<small>[[Reference:submariner\|Submariner]] -> '''5517'''</small>		<small>[[Reference:submariner\|Submariner]] › '''5517'''</small>

	The 5517 is the MilSub: the British military Submariner, purpose-built for the Ministry of Defence and never sold through any retail channel. Production ran across three batches roughly 1972 to 1979 in two distinct serial bands — the 3.9M cluster for the early 5513 and 5513/5517 double-reference watches, the 5.3M cluster for the dedicated 5517 batch.		The 5517 is the MilSub: the British military Submariner, purpose-built for the Ministry of Defence and never sold through any retail channel. Production ran across three batches roughly 1972 to 1979 in two distinct serial bands — the 3.9M cluster for the early 5513 and 5513/5517 double-reference watches, the 5.3M cluster for the dedicated 5517 batch.
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	== Core facts ==		== Core facts ==

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable rp-facts"
	\|-		\|-
	! detail		! detail

Admin: site-wide: domain move BezelBase → Rolexopedia (rolexopedia.net)

2026-09-05T00:37:56Z

site-wide: domain move BezelBase → Rolexopedia (rolexopedia.net)

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:37, 5 September 2026
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	{{DISPLAYTITLE:Rolex 5517 Submariner}}		{{DISPLAYTITLE:Rolex 5517 Submariner}}
	{{#seo:		{{#seo:
	\|title=Rolex Submariner 5517 'MilSub' — Military Issue, 1971–1974 \| ~~BezelBase~~		\|title=Rolex Submariner 5517 'MilSub' — Military Issue, 1971–1974 \| Rolexopedia
	\|description=The 5517 is the British military Submariner. Three batches across roughly 1972-1979, fixed bars, full 60-minute bezel, sword hands, T SWISS T tritium dial. Phillips Geneva XIV 2021 CHF 504,000 result is the public auction record.		\|description=The 5517 is the British military Submariner. Three batches across roughly 1972-1979, fixed bars, full 60-minute bezel, sword hands, T SWISS T tritium dial. Phillips Geneva XIV 2021 CHF 504,000 result is the public auction record.
	\|keywords=Rolex, 5517, MilSub, Royal Navy, military Submariner, broadsword hands, T SWISS T		\|keywords=Rolex, 5517, MilSub, Royal Navy, military Submariner, broadsword hands, T SWISS T

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:47, 28 September 2026
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	The 5517’s military parts and provenance make authentication difficult, and genuine examples have sold for high prices in the cited auctions. A standard 5513 can be altered with replacement parts, so case, bezel, dial, hands, engravings, movement, and provenance must be checked together.		The 5517’s military parts and provenance make authentication difficult, and genuine examples have sold for high prices in the cited auctions. A standard 5513 can be altered with replacement parts, so case, bezel, dial, hands, engravings, movement, and provenance must be checked together.

	Phillips documents examples with caseback and movement or case-number histories that require explanation. A non-matching number ~~is not automatically proof of fakery, but it needs~~ documented service or issue history~~; a~~ matching set ~~is not proof of authenticity by itself~~.		Phillips documents examples with caseback and movement or case-number histories that require explanation. A non-matching number requires documented service or issue history. A matching set still needs the same provenance and physical checks.

	“5513-T-MOD” and “5517-T-MOD” are dealer and collector terms rather than Rolex references. Use the documented reference, case marks, parts, and provenance instead.		“5513-T-MOD” and “5517-T-MOD” are dealer and collector terms rather than Rolex references. Use the documented reference, case marks, parts, and provenance instead.
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	\| Sotheby's Important Watches I Geneva \|\| 3 \|\| 2023 \|\| 5,339,705 \|\| Batch 3, c.1978 Maxi I, issue 853/78 \|\| CHF 482,600		\| Sotheby's Important Watches I Geneva \|\| 3 \|\| 2023 \|\| 5,339,705 \|\| Batch 3, c.1978 Maxi I, issue 853/78 \|\| CHF 482,600
	\|-		\|-
	\| Phillips Bacs & Russo Geneva \|\| — \|\| 2025 \|\| — \|\| 5517 39mm \|\| USD 401,270		\| Phillips Bacs & Russo Geneva \|\| - \|\| 2025 \|\| - \|\| 5517 39mm \|\| USD 401,270
	\|-		\|-
	\| Antiquorum Monaco \|\| 353-77 \|\| 2022 \|\| 3,926,842 \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1975, W10 issue 960/79 \|\| EUR 260,000		\| Antiquorum Monaco \|\| 353-77 \|\| 2022 \|\| 3,926,842 \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1975, W10 issue 960/79 \|\| EUR 260,000
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	\| Phillips New York "Game Changers" \|\| 28 \|\| 2019 \|\| 3,926,768 \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1972, Royal Navy issue 688/77 \|\| USD 218,750		\| Phillips New York "Game Changers" \|\| 28 \|\| 2019 \|\| 3,926,768 \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1972, Royal Navy issue 688/77 \|\| USD 218,750
	\|-		\|-
	\| Bonhams London Knightsbridge \|\| — \|\| 2022 \|\| — \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1975, original Royal Navy diver provenance, caseback 691/77 \|\| GBP 195,600 incl. premium		\| Bonhams London Knightsbridge \|\| - \|\| 2022 \|\| - \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1975, original Royal Navy diver provenance, caseback 691/77 \|\| GBP 195,600 incl. premium
	\|-		\|-
	\| Phillips Bacs & Russo Geneva \|\| — \|\| 2024 \|\| — \|\| 5517 \|\| USD 123,283		\| Phillips Bacs & Russo Geneva \|\| - \|\| 2024 \|\| - \|\| 5517 \|\| USD 123,283
	\|-		\|-
	\| Wannenes Italy \|\| — \|\| 2025 \|\| — \|\| 5517 39mm \|\| USD 182,178		\| Wannenes Italy \|\| - \|\| 2025 \|\| - \|\| 5517 39mm \|\| USD 182,178
	\|-		\|-
	\| Fellows Birmingham Luxury Watch Sale \|\| 129 \|\| 2020 \|\| — \|\| 5517, MOD engravings \|\| GBP 174,800 incl. premium (Fellows house record)		\| Fellows Birmingham Luxury Watch Sale \|\| 129 \|\| 2020 \|\| - \|\| 5517, MOD engravings \|\| GBP 174,800 incl. premium (Fellows house record)
	\|-		\|-
	\| Phillips Hong Kong \|\| 807 \|\| 2017 \|\| 3,926,923 \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1974, W10 Army issue 941/79 \|\| HK$ 1,625,000		\| Phillips Hong Kong \|\| 807 \|\| 2017 \|\| 3,926,923 \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1974, W10 Army issue 941/79 \|\| HK$ 1,625,000
	\|-		\|-
	\| Sotheby's New York \|\| 238 \|\| 2018 \|\| — \|\| 5517 c.1978, MOD engravings \|\| not publicly listed		\| Sotheby's New York \|\| 238 \|\| 2018 \|\| - \|\| 5517 c.1978, MOD engravings \|\| not publicly listed
	\|-		\|-
	\| Sotheby's Important Watches II Geneva \|\| 64 \|\| 2023 \|\| 3,926,898 \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1973, Maxi Mk I pumpkin patina \|\| not publicly listed		\| Sotheby's Important Watches II Geneva \|\| 64 \|\| 2023 \|\| 3,926,898 \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1973, Maxi Mk I pumpkin patina \|\| not publicly listed
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	\| Bonhams London Fine Watches \|\| 90 \|\| 2018 \|\| 392xxxx \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1972, military engravings removed, inner caseback I.72 \|\| GBP 72,500 incl. premium		\| Bonhams London Fine Watches \|\| 90 \|\| 2018 \|\| 392xxxx \|\| Batch 2 5513/5517, c.1972, military engravings removed, inner caseback I.72 \|\| GBP 72,500 incl. premium
	\|-		\|-
	\| Phillips New York "Winning Icons" \|\| 48 \|\| 2017 \|\| — \|\| 5513/5517, 1979, W10 Army Air Corps \|\| not publicly listed		\| Phillips New York "Winning Icons" \|\| 48 \|\| 2017 \|\| - \|\| 5513/5517, 1979, W10 Army Air Corps \|\| not publicly listed
	\|}		\|}